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Real Warp Drives. 
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Since it now seems like to be in fact possible, I would like to open this thread for its discussion.

First off, we don't know the effect of having more than one warp ring. Reasoning by analogy, by using what the European Space Agency has done with ion drives, I will assume that an additional warp ring will have the following affect: It will increase the possible speed from ten C to one hundred c. Why? Because it was the ESA, that discovered that if you had a two stage ion drive, that Isp, was increased ten fold. So following this change, one may assume, that for every doubling of rings, that the speed will be increased ten fold. So four ring will give a speed of one thousand c, and so on. But! Since we are dealing with a field, as the distance betwen the first and the last grows, there will be some fall off. Rate of fall off unknown. Inverse square law suggests what happens. To, as the total speed times c increases, there will be a steeper and steeper abruptness to the field in total. This if left uncountered may destroy the ship, because parts of the ship may be outside of the field. Further more, instabilites may arise due to imperfection in the manufacture of said warp rings. This must be accounted for.

Note if A. I. is involved in the first FTL unmanned probes due to their small size(speculation), then it is likely to have gpas, in the lines of though formed. That is, they will fail in ways an organic would not, under conditions that a properly trained organic crew member would not. This may explain why crews are used aboard most Federation ships.


28 Sep 2012 10:17
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I kept thinking on something yesterday after posting this. In TMoST, it is stated that the Enterprise is powered by something called a space warp.... I wonder if this could be used to power something?


29 Sep 2012 07:48
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I'm not so sure...

I'm thinking that real warp travel if we ever have it will use beamed energy propulsion.

Now wait, you say--the beam can only travel at lightspeed. True enough--but an intersection point between two beams?

An example take a solar system wide Marquee sign. You have a wide array of lights. Each vertical bank of vertically stacked lights is about 1 AU apart from the next bank. Now if you have one bank of lights turn on after they 'see' the previous bank of lights turn off--well, there's your light delay. Now, if one bank of lights is pre-programmed to turn on right after after the previous one turns off--that's fine.

From a distance, you have a pattern of 'off' lights that races across the array at FTL speeds--even thought the light from each bank is only at c.

Patterns, like warps, can be most any speed: http://cosmoquest.org/forum/archive/ind ... 97480.html

Now IIRC, the small perturbation they want to create--a mini warp--uses a laser beam. But what if you use two beams and have the intersection point be where the warp ship enters--and rides a warp along an intersection point. So you fire the laser beams ahead of time before adjusting the beam intersection point.

Now I was reading about deep space mission to the solar foci. After a time, you don't get a focal point--but a focal line.

These two techniques might be useful in some way:
http://arxiv.org/abs/1207.7030
http://arxiv.org/abs/1207.6780

Maybe if one could cloak the mass of the craft's Higgs field--it could then ride the intersection point perhaps:
http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=181216&page=2

Aridas own ring shaped impeller/subspace catapault/gateway station design may also play a part in bootstrapping outward.

The warp ship is going to eat power, and I seem to remember hearing that a craft cannot generate its own warp bubble--so there are problems:
http://www.universetoday.com/93882/warp ... -downside/
But that does seem to release a lot of energy too--but first, you have to have that energy...

Aridas own ring shaped impeller/subspace catapault/gateway station design may also play a part in bootstrapping outward.

In other words, I don't think you can have a ship turn on it's own warp drive and go where it wants. You are going to have to have some in-space infrastructure--and a lot of it--Babylon % gate style I would think.

http://www.trekbbs.com/showpost.php?p=7 ... stcount=74
http://news.discovery.com/space/how-to- ... 20924.html
http://www.futureincredible.com/2011/wa ... ence-fact/

Take a look at this: http://www.space.com/2129-research-warp ... drive.html
Felber's "analysis found that a mass moving faster than 57.7 percent of the speed of light will gravitationally repel other masses lying within a narrow "antigravity beam" in front of it. The closer a mass gets to the speed of light, the stronger this antigravity beam becomes. Thus, the forward antigravity field of a suitably heavy and fast mass might be used to propel a payload from rest to relativistic speeds."

You might need a run and go to enter the warp?


29 Sep 2012 15:20
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or maybe just a convenient 'tachyon eddy'... ; )

-- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Explorers_ ... ce_Nine%29

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29 Sep 2012 16:48
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Too unrelible.

What interests me at the moment, is; what happens if over time, there is a very strong corralation between Star Trek, and the real world warp drive??? Which is what I meant in another thread up in discussion by things might get serious. At least for GR.... :ugeek:

What I mean is, what happens, if as we go into the future, the U. S. S. Enterprise of TOS fame, really turns out to be totally realistic???? At least on the outside....

Now another thought occurs to me along those same lines. What is the space warp iss merely the beginning to everything, that is, as we send out ships out there, we find that we are forced, to adat various ideas, as we have always been(reality can be a bit trying at times) such that it becomes praticle for certain ideas to be developed?


01 Oct 2012 18:02
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Commodore
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Quote:
Too unrelible.


if you mean chaotic and unpredictable, yes... ; )

but some form of tachyon/subspace/soliton sailing seems feasible -- whether it's through a point to point network of nodes... or using the 'natural' tides and currents of space/subspace itself...

and then we get to use so many cool sailing ship metaphors in space... : )

-- http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/M ... eIsAnOcean
-- http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SpaceSailing
-- http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/M ... orkThatWay
-- http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SpaceMadness
-- http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/M ... dLeviathan
-- http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/M ... hipScuffle
-- http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/M ... HyperSpace

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All matter originates and exists only by virtue of a force...
We must assume behind this force the existence of a conscious and intelligent Mind.
This Mind is the matrix of all matter.
Max Planck


02 Oct 2012 14:19
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By way, on a side note, an Ion Storm, is merely one huge solar flare....


03 Oct 2012 09:26
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I hate to say it, but I don't think real warp drive will be anything other than a ringship--of that:
http://io9.com/5906586/its-time-to-move ... the-future?

As science fiction writer Charles Stross has noted, the spaceship is a myth. It's an old-fangled vision of how humans might go about space travel that doesn't take into account the problems of distance, time and available resources — and of course, new innovations.

Instead, Stross and a number of other thinkers argue that it would be more realistic to drop the word "ship" from discussions of interstellar travel and instead contemplate the requirements for an "interstellar transportation system." An indisputable reality of space travel is that virtually nothing will await our intrepid explorers once they reach their destination — and that's assuming they could survive the journey. At best they could hope for are some rocks, sunlight, and slushy water. All materials required to build an initial infrastructure would have to be brought along for the ride — not an easy undertaking.

What Stross proposes is a system that utilizes machine-phase diamond-substrate nanotechnology, mind uploading, and artificial general intelligence. The end result wouldn't be much like a "ship". Rather, it would consist of a diamondoid data storage device (which would hold the data patterns of the uninstantiated space travelers) hanging below a light sail.


06 Oct 2012 15:44
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hmm... a starfaring nano-age story would still have some adventure possibilities... : )


contemplating the 'you're on your own...' aspect

"Another one of them new worlds. No beer, no women, no pool parlors, nothin'. Nothin' to do but throw rocks at tin cans, and we gotta bring our own tin cans."

the thought of a diamond age solar sailship...

"Star sapphires take a week to crystallize properly. Would diamonds or emeralds do?"

or the personality upload aspect... ; )

"I'm in command of 18 competitively selected super-perfect physical specimens with an average age of 24.6 who have been locked up in hyperspace for 378 days. It would have served you right if I hadn't... and he... oh go on, get out of here before I have you run out of the area under guard - and then I'll put more guards on the guards!"

the possibility of finding some thing unexpected...

"Yes, a single machine, a cube 20 miles on each side."

"The fool, the meddling idiot! As though his ape's brain could contain the secrets of the Krell!"



-- http://www.inquisitr.com/343575/turner- ... e-station/

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All matter originates and exists only by virtue of a force...
We must assume behind this force the existence of a conscious and intelligent Mind.
This Mind is the matrix of all matter.
Max Planck


06 Oct 2012 19:51
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No, publiuser, the author you mentioned hasn't hought about human nature. Further more, it takes all the fun out of the journey...

Another thing, how does he know what we will find out there??? Yes, chances are against, but this is nothing new, they have always been against us. any time you stand up, there is for example a 50/50 chance of you falling flat on your face....

So this is nothing o fear hear. just SNAFU(Situation Normal, All Fouled Up.)

And it is not as we have a choice the matter either, we must go to the stars or die here, as a species....


08 Oct 2012 07:39
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